[Ltsp-discuss] winxp in virtual vdi inside Ubuntu ltsp server

[richard kweskin]

I will be assisting in setting up ltsp using 32bit Ubuntu 12.04 in a
school for kids aged 9 to 13 yrs old. The school has asked that windows
be also available as they have win software they use.

My thought was to include on the ltsp server a vdi with windows xp
using virtualbox. The 16 clients will all be fat with 1 GB ram each.
What advice can anyone offer so that the vdi is small enough but useable
on the clients?

As not all clients have the same hardware configuration should a live
cd image e.g. Hirens be used to accommodate the various clients or is
this not an issue?

Richard

[Michael Pope]

Post by richard kweskin
I will be assisting in setting up ltsp using 32bit Ubuntu 12.04 in a
school for kids aged 9 to 13 yrs old. The school has asked that windows
be also available as they have win software they use.
My thought was to include on the ltsp server a vdi with windows xp
using virtualbox. The 16 clients will all be fat with 1 GB ram each.
What advice can anyone offer so that the vdi is small enough but useable
on the clients?
As not all clients have the same hardware configuration should a live
cd image e.g. Hirens be used to accommodate the various clients or is
this not an issue?
Richard
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello Richard,

I used to do this at work but have now moved over to using KVM for the
Win XP images instead as it's easier to manage from a server point of
view. It depends on what you're doing though as KVM doesn't handle 3d
graphics so Virtualbox maybe a better choice if you have 3d programs.
I've just found it harder to manage on an LTSP system.

The advantages of KVM over Vitualbox in an LTSP system are;
- Central management is easier as you access all the images in one place
(virtualbox you have to login to each user)
- Kernel updates are easier (although you could use the open source
version of Virtualbox I don't think it requires modules to be compiled
for the kernel on every update)
- virt-manager is really easy to use.

from
Michael

[richard kweskin]

Post by Michael Pope
Hello Richard,
I used to do this at work but have now moved over to using KVM for the
Win XP images instead as it's easier to manage from a server point of
view. It depends on what you're doing though as KVM doesn't handle 3d
graphics so Virtualbox maybe a better choice if you have 3d programs.
I've just found it harder to manage on an LTSP system.
The advantages of KVM over Vitualbox in an LTSP system are;
- Central management is easier as you access all the images in one place
(virtualbox you have to login to each user)
- Kernel updates are easier (although you could use the open source
version of Virtualbox I don't think it requires modules to be
compiled
for the kernel on every update)
- virt-manager is really easy to use.
from
Michael

Thank you Michael for your input. Frankly I am a complete newbie with
virtualization. The only reason I mentioned virtualbox was because
others near us have already been using it. I am going to look into using
KVM.

Richard

[Johan Kragsterman]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[richard kweskin]

First of all, different client hw is normally not a problem for fat
clients, but of course you need to test. Especially if the graphic
driver isn't in the kernel.

Thank you for that info, Johan. I had no idea about this.

The best window$ solution depends on the software they want to run.
If
it is possible to use a windows terminal server, that is for me the
best solution.

I hope to use as little Microsoft product as possible, although I
understand it would be more straight forward.

And why use VB if you can use KVM?

Aha, so you and Michael both seem to prefer KVM. That is growing in
significance for me. Unfortunately, I have had no previous experience
with any form of virtualization, although I have been reading so many
others' comment on it.

Rgrds Johan

Richard

[r***@giesler.za.net]

Forget running XP in a VM on 1GB RAM. Use libvirt and run it on the server and you should be fine.
Sent from my BlackBerry®

-----Original Message-----
From: richard kweskin <***@hellug.gr>
Date: Mon, 01 Jun 2015 12:53:42
To: <ltsp-***@lists.sourceforge.net>
Reply-To: ltsp-***@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: [Ltsp-discuss] winxp in virtual vdi inside Ubuntu ltsp server

I will be assisting in setting up ltsp using 32bit Ubuntu 12.04 in a
school for kids aged 9 to 13 yrs old. The school has asked that windows
be also available as they have win software they use.

My thought was to include on the ltsp server a vdi with windows xp
using virtualbox. The 16 clients will all be fat with 1 GB ram each.
What advice can anyone offer so that the vdi is small enough but useable
on the clients?

As not all clients have the same hardware configuration should a live
cd image e.g. Hirens be used to accommodate the various clients or is
this not an issue?

Richard

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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[richard kweskin]

Post by r***@giesler.za.net
Forget running XP in a VM on 1GB RAM. Use libvirt and run it on the
server and you should be fine.
Sent from my BlackBerry®

Thank you, Roland, for your input. As I have said to the others
responding I have no prior experience of any virtual software
whatsoever, so I am very grateful for your info. I will look into this
form you mention to see how and what are the trade offs.

Richard

[Άλκης Γεωργόπουλος]

Hi Richard,

KVM is just a bit better than VBox when the CPU supports hardware
acceleration (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86_virtualization),
but it's *extremely* slower when it doesn't,
and since CPUs that don't support hardware acceleration are usually
already a bit slower than the rest,
it's unsuitable for large deployments when you're sure that at least
some of the clients will not support hw assisted virtualization.

Moreover, VirtualBox is way better than KVM with regards to graphics
acceleration under Windows.

So if you're planning to select a method for schools to have Windows
over LTSP, VirtualBox (or VmWare if you don't care about having an
open source solution) are much better than KVM.

Remote desktop is very slow, it's unsuited for multimedia apps that
schools need.
And Linux+LTSP+VboxManage only need 256 MB RAM, leaving 768 MB free
out of 1 GB RAM, so the result is fine even on an 8-year old
Atom-based netbook that I tested with.

To have multiple users using a single .VDI file, you'd use snapshots
over a read-only base image, it's possible to write an LTSP screen
script for that if you don't need a Linux session.

Cheers,
Alkis

[Funke, Martin]

Hello,

this sounds like a very interesting project but I don’t understand how you do it.

Just as an info im using xubuntu 14.04 and ltsp 5.5.1

Do you install vbox and the vm and do a new image with ltsp-update-image -c /? Then every client should have vbox and the vm to work with.

Or do you install it on the server and exclude it from the ltsp-image-build and let every client access the vm on the server?

Or maybe there is a third even better way to do this.

Best regards
Martin

[Alkis Georgopoulos]

Post by Funke, Martin
Hello,
this sounds like a very interesting project but I don’t understand how you do it.

You can expose the .vdi file using nbd.
The client image just needs to have vbox installed, it doesn't need to
contain the .vdi image.